Singapore Press Holdings (SPH)

[Temperament]

Congrats, well below your sell price of 3.98(?)! ..... (-15 cents from 3.98 to low just now of 3.83)

A fine-tuning which I'd recently added to my process (after STEng experience) - the "best" selling price is likely the one when it surges a couple more cents in any of the days prior to xd. For eg., STEng surged to $3.30 before it slowly settled to $3.24 on last day of cd ; SPH surged to $3.98 before it slowly settled to $3.93 on last day of cd.

So, anyone out there still believe in EMH (Efficient Market Hypothesis)??

i glad that all my Q at $3.99 are not done before XD. The opening price after XD is $3.85. So if i sell at $3.85 + 7 cents dividend, it will be = $3.92 A different of -7 cents. So you see market's sentiment is still intact. IMO.

I'd strong suggest you either use a Spreadsheet or at least a Calculator (HP Apps also have) to do your sums before you do any selling! BTW, $3.85 + 7ct = $3.92

Ya lol! Since the invention of electronic calculator, sometimes doing simple mental sum is challenging. Fortunately, for people like me "tak boh chek one" are helped by financial software in the market. i use "Microsoft Money" to track all my money since 24 years ago. Do you have any opinion on the discontinued "Microsoft Money"? So far until today, i am still happy using it.

[CityFarmer]

It is a common experience to see my sell order been broken-down into several transactions before fully sold. It is perfectly possible for partial fulfillment of sale order

Yes, if your sell order volume has to be matched with several counter parties on the buy side whose individual buy volume is smaller than your sell volume.

But your single sell order volume cannot be broken down such that some other seller can go in between.

How about some other seller go in between with lower selling price? I assume it is possible.

[swakoo]

How about some other seller go in between with lower selling price? I assume it is possible.

Yes but it is not go in between, it is go under.

[CityFarmer]

How about some other seller go in between with lower selling price? I assume it is possible.

Yes but it is not go in between, it is go under.

Correct me if i am wrong, The story Kopikat is telling is "go under" with lower selling price (wrt last closing price) to jump Q. If you are lucky (when no buying at lower price), then you can complete the selling with last closing price. In other words, it is "effectively go in between" although you did it with "go under"

I am starting to get confuse, better stop here

[Temperament]

i had one experience of selling 9 lots of my one 10 lots sell order during after 5pm closing. So am i correct to say my order was the last order matched for that day? Or someone had one lot go under my sell order price for that day?
i believe though we are "long term" investors, we still need to really understand how to get the best B/S price during the pre-opening and pre-closing market's practice.

[Jared Seah]

For those who want to play during the pre-opening and closing:

http://rulebook.sgx.com/net_file_store/n...1_2011.pdf

Proprietary traders have an advantage due to their trading platforms.

Openings are by amateurs (panic sellers and eager buyers); while closings are by professionals (net-off positions in the day and "influence" futures index prices)

[violinist]

Thought this is a value investment, fundamental analysis, long term investment forum?

[Temperament]

For those who want to play during the pre-opening and closing:

http://rulebook.sgx.com/net_file_store/n...1_2011.pdf

Proprietary traders have an advantage due to their trading platforms.

Openings are by amateurs (panic sellers and eager buyers); while closings are by professionals (net-off positions in the day and "influence" futures index prices)

SGX only shows 3 price-matched examples. It is complicated enough. i wonder how many combinations of price-matched are possible. So in the end it is best to stick to the price you are happy to B/S. Put in whatever price you want but must be happy about it.

---

Thought this is a value investment, fundamental analysis, long term investment forum?

Yes indeed it is. All fundamentalist investors also need to learn to sell or buy at the best price through how SGX operates. You can't only learn value of a company and forget about everything else. Investment is definitely more than learning how to value. The more things you know about the market, the better you will make your investment decision. IMO.
NB:
Sorli i am a "Rojak Investor" who manages to survive 24 years and dare to appear here to try to learn something, from all people here, regardless of good or bad advice, idea, experience...etc.. i will volunteer to stop posting here if moderators say only people who talk about values are welcome here. i am speaking on behalf of people who sometimes deviate. Sorli.

[KopiKat]

Thought this is a value investment, fundamental analysis, long term investment forum?

Don't put too much confidence into SPH, this is a long term doom counter. Dividends may be good in the short term outlook, but long term it is slowly dying off. Better get rid of it as soon as possible. SELL!

Yes, we have done our Fundamental Analysis on SPH, agree that 'Price is what you Pay, Value is what you get' to determine at what Price (entry), there's still Value to be gotten from SPH. As long as SPH stays at the Price (where there's Value to continue holding), we'll continue holding it for Long Term.

BUT, as you'd also rightly pointed out that SPH is a 'Long Term Doom' stock, one of the approach would of course to avoid it. However, for the 'Die-Hard' fans (or 'Long-Term' Sufferer) of SPH, I don't see why we shouldn't utilise our Long Term knowledge + familiarity to actively 'manage' our portfolio to 'squeeze' some extra profits out of SPH?

Benjamin Graham also talked about Passive vs Active Investors and if you'd be kind enough to allow it, perhaps we can fool ourself and be classified as 'Over-Active' Investors or 'Hyper-Active' Investors.

Note that in my case, at any point in time (even now), I'd still retain some SPH shares, never zero (Hee.. I do have some odd lots from their Capital Reduction long ago...).


Just to add, Warren Buffett ever mentioned that Financial Derivatives are Weapons of Mass Destruction. When he subsequently revealed that Berkshire had invested in some, does it make him a hypocrite or less of a Value Investor??

I don't think so... As long as you know what you are doing and is able to determine at what price there's 'Value' vs 'Probability' (Odds in your favour), I see it as Value Investing. Yes, even for 'cheap thrills' like our SPH example. Our excuse --- we saw Value!

Ok, enough of this nonsense.. No more posting in SPH thread until I see 'Value'... So much potential 'Value' now in the market with STI -70... Have to check my spreadsheet to see which stock offers the best 'Value' !! Hee... not going to share too much as it creates too much distraction having to justify my actions!

[Temperament]

Thought this is a value investment, fundamental analysis, long term investment forum?

Don't put too much confidence into SPH, this is a long term doom counter. Dividends may be good in the short term outlook, but long term it is slowly dying off. Better get rid of it as soon as possible. SELL!

Yes, we have done our Fundamental Analysis on SPH, agree that 'Price is what you Pay, Value is what you get' to determine at what Price (entry), there's still Value to be gotten from SPH. As long as SPH stays at the Price (where there's Value to continue holding), we'll continue holding it for Long Term.

BUT, as you'd also rightly pointed out that SPH is a 'Long Term Doom' stock, one of the approach would of course to avoid it. However, for the 'Die-Hard' fans (or 'Long-Term' Sufferer) of SPH, I don't see why we shouldn't utilise our Long Term knowledge + familiarity to actively 'manage' our portfolio to 'squeeze' some extra profits out of SPH?

Benjamin Graham also talked about Passive vs Active Investors and if you'd be kind enough to allow it, perhaps we can fool ourself and be classified as 'Over-Active' Investors or 'Hyper-Active' Investors.

Note that in my case, at any point in time (even now), I'd still retain some SPH shares, never zero (Hee.. I do have some odd lots from their Capital Reduction long ago...).


Just to add, Warren Buffett ever mentioned that Financial Derivatives are Weapons of Mass Destruction. When he subsequently revealed that Berkshire had invested in some, does it make him a hypocrite or less of a Value Investor??

I don't think so... As long as you know what you are doing and is able to determine at what price there's 'Value' vs 'Probability' (Odds in your favour), I see it as Value Investing. Yes, even for 'cheap thrills' like our SPH example. Our excuse --- we saw Value!

Ok, enough of this nonsense.. No more posting in SPH thread until I see 'Value'... So much potential 'Value' now in the market with STI -70... Have to check my spreadsheet to see which stock offers the best 'Value' !! Hee... not going to share too much as it creates too much distraction having to justify my actions!

Ya lol! i have a lop-sided portfolio. SPH is my main counter giving me the main profit because i have sold off all my reits. Not advisable by the books you will say.